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	<title>Comments on: Theological Temptations: Grandiosity</title>
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	<description>Serving the joyful cultivation of the theological craft for the life of the church: inquiring honestly, deliberating wisely, acting faithfully</description>
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		<title>By: links for 2009-05-04 &#124; The 'K' is not silent</title>
		<link>http://theologyforum.wordpress.com/2009/04/29/theological-temptations-grandiosity/#comment-10387</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[links for 2009-05-04 &#124; The 'K' is not silent]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 May 2009 06:01:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theologyforum.wordpress.com/?p=2087#comment-10387</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Theological Temptations: Grandiosity « Theology Forum (tags: article theology) [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Theological Temptations: Grandiosity « Theology Forum (tags: article theology) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Linkworthy - 5/3/09 &#124; MattCleaver.com</title>
		<link>http://theologyforum.wordpress.com/2009/04/29/theological-temptations-grandiosity/#comment-10340</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Linkworthy - 5/3/09 &#124; MattCleaver.com]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 May 2009 16:07:17 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[[...] Grandiosity - A theological temptation. Especially pertinent for us young seminarians. [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Grandiosity &#8211; A theological temptation. Especially pertinent for us young seminarians. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas Price</title>
		<link>http://theologyforum.wordpress.com/2009/04/29/theological-temptations-grandiosity/#comment-10267</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Thomas Price]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 11:40:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theologyforum.wordpress.com/?p=2087#comment-10267</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yes, James, there is much commonality of themes in Rowan Williams and Nicholas Lash, and, being that they&#039;re seasoned friends, I find this all the more impressive. Glad you and Kyle will be purchasing the book (I&#039;m sure Prof. Lash will be too..haha).  Ever since I attended Lash&#039;s lectures on &#039;Believing Three Ways in God&#039; and his fabled seminar on analogy (during his last series of away terms given at Duke upon his retirement), I&#039;ve found this theological insight into the gospel&#039;s core consequence of helping humans &#039;be weaned from idolatry&#039; and become a people of worshipful living to be a profound leitmotif running through his work.  And it&#039;s trinitarian and incarnational anchorage all the more impressive in articulating theological existence (although  I&#039;d adjust things along a more Reformed line, I do find great overlap on this focus). Hence, if you haven&#039;t read these already, save those funds and also grab Lash&#039;s &#039;Believing Three Ways in God&#039; and &#039;Theology on the Road to Emmaus&#039; and &#039;Easter in Ordinary&#039; (and no I don&#039;t work for Lash or the publishing house....haha).
Pax et Spes]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, James, there is much commonality of themes in Rowan Williams and Nicholas Lash, and, being that they&#8217;re seasoned friends, I find this all the more impressive. Glad you and Kyle will be purchasing the book (I&#8217;m sure Prof. Lash will be too..haha).  Ever since I attended Lash&#8217;s lectures on &#8216;Believing Three Ways in God&#8217; and his fabled seminar on analogy (during his last series of away terms given at Duke upon his retirement), I&#8217;ve found this theological insight into the gospel&#8217;s core consequence of helping humans &#8216;be weaned from idolatry&#8217; and become a people of worshipful living to be a profound leitmotif running through his work.  And it&#8217;s trinitarian and incarnational anchorage all the more impressive in articulating theological existence (although  I&#8217;d adjust things along a more Reformed line, I do find great overlap on this focus). Hence, if you haven&#8217;t read these already, save those funds and also grab Lash&#8217;s &#8216;Believing Three Ways in God&#8217; and &#8216;Theology on the Road to Emmaus&#8217; and &#8216;Easter in Ordinary&#8217; (and no I don&#8217;t work for Lash or the publishing house&#8230;.haha).<br />
Pax et Spes</p>
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		<title>By: Kyle Strobel</title>
		<link>http://theologyforum.wordpress.com/2009/04/29/theological-temptations-grandiosity/#comment-10234</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kyle Strobel]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 19:57:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theologyforum.wordpress.com/?p=2087#comment-10234</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The Merton quote is from the &quot;Vocation&quot; chapter in &quot;No Man Is An Island&quot;

Thomas, thanks for your input - it is always incredibly thoughtful. With James, I am thinking that I need to pick up Lash&#039;s Theology of Pilgrims as well.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Merton quote is from the &#8220;Vocation&#8221; chapter in &#8220;No Man Is An Island&#8221;</p>
<p>Thomas, thanks for your input &#8211; it is always incredibly thoughtful. With James, I am thinking that I need to pick up Lash&#8217;s Theology of Pilgrims as well.</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas Price</title>
		<link>http://theologyforum.wordpress.com/2009/04/29/theological-temptations-grandiosity/#comment-10203</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Thomas Price]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 02:13:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://theologyforum.wordpress.com/?p=2087#comment-10203</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Kyle, I enjoyed your blog here much, and appreciate your reflections on theological integrity and honesty in carrying out theological work. I think your gloss on the idolatry of grandiosity and its spiritual concomitants important; theological vocation is a part of theological existence, and the moment the theologian becomes engrossed with his/herself, and less with the Sache of Scripture, is the moment the theologian re-entangles his/herself in the web of idolatry&#039;s manifold delusions and spiritual maladies. I think here of Calvin&#039;s notion of humans (and theologians in particular) as being idol-making machines. This temptation is always at hand because it is so definitive of our fallen nature. And the cost of such a giving into this temptation is a dangerous disordering  of our very lives and our theological produce.  

I think it also significant to widen your point out of the enclave of theological work and identity and highlight its import for anthropological considerations more generally.  Your point about the existential &#039;bi-polar angst&#039; that grows out of a person&#039;s anchoring of his/her identity in their individual significance, whether it be their roles, functions or productivity, is a helpful way into localising one of the variant ways in which idolatrous living disorders and disorients human existence. The polarised extremes of dislocated selves in modern life and the unhealthy role that certain types of perfectionism (fundamentalist spiritualities or their secularised equivalents) play in the bifurcations are fragments of the larger story of sin and its radical consequence.  But the good news is found in sin&#039;s overcoming, an overcoming which transposes the idolatrous self into the majestic presence of God upon the liberating announcement of our restoration in Christ. This liberation has the grand consequence of teaching us to &#039;be creatures&#039; (as Nicholas Lash so often reminded us). Here there is a grand freedom. Firstly, it is the freedom of not having our selves defined by anything other than our createdness and ultimate dependence on God. In the knowlede of God in Christ is revealed too the mystery of our createdness, and the centring of our being and action in eschatological existence. Here, our central identity is not located in &#039;our&#039; vocation, production, social alliances (as absolute magnitudes), etc, but in God&#039;s good ordering of the world and our place in it as receiving our true selves in  God&#039;s self-giving (which includes these things but not as absolutes determining our existence). Secondly, it is the freedom that we don&#039;t have to be perfectionists.  To quote Lash &#039;The story of this learning process (on learning to be a creature) is the history of Jewish and Christian doctrines of God...there is a sense in which each generation, and indeed each individual, has to take the time to learn this for themselves; has to grow, or fail to grow, into something of what it means to be, in every fibre of one&#039;s being, absolutely dependent on the mystery that we call God&#039; {Lash, Theology for Pilgrims, pp. 25}. 

Lash&#039;s  last point I think great for your theme here. That the temptation of thinking &#039;we&#039; are central is fundamentally the idolatrous thinking that we are not creatures but &#039;God&#039;... the central significant for determing our selves and our relations. And the spiritual consequence of this has been the &#039;hells&#039; of life. However, the liberation that comes from attuning afresh to God&#039;s self-manifestation in Christ is not simply the re-placement of ourselves as the central object of our concern, devotion and self-interpretation, but its the very ground that gives us the right kind of reading of our lives and significance in our place in the ordering of the world. We do our best work and love when we&#039;re not fixated on ourselves.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kyle, I enjoyed your blog here much, and appreciate your reflections on theological integrity and honesty in carrying out theological work. I think your gloss on the idolatry of grandiosity and its spiritual concomitants important; theological vocation is a part of theological existence, and the moment the theologian becomes engrossed with his/herself, and less with the Sache of Scripture, is the moment the theologian re-entangles his/herself in the web of idolatry&#8217;s manifold delusions and spiritual maladies. I think here of Calvin&#8217;s notion of humans (and theologians in particular) as being idol-making machines. This temptation is always at hand because it is so definitive of our fallen nature. And the cost of such a giving into this temptation is a dangerous disordering  of our very lives and our theological produce.  </p>
<p>I think it also significant to widen your point out of the enclave of theological work and identity and highlight its import for anthropological considerations more generally.  Your point about the existential &#8216;bi-polar angst&#8217; that grows out of a person&#8217;s anchoring of his/her identity in their individual significance, whether it be their roles, functions or productivity, is a helpful way into localising one of the variant ways in which idolatrous living disorders and disorients human existence. The polarised extremes of dislocated selves in modern life and the unhealthy role that certain types of perfectionism (fundamentalist spiritualities or their secularised equivalents) play in the bifurcations are fragments of the larger story of sin and its radical consequence.  But the good news is found in sin&#8217;s overcoming, an overcoming which transposes the idolatrous self into the majestic presence of God upon the liberating announcement of our restoration in Christ. This liberation has the grand consequence of teaching us to &#8216;be creatures&#8217; (as Nicholas Lash so often reminded us). Here there is a grand freedom. Firstly, it is the freedom of not having our selves defined by anything other than our createdness and ultimate dependence on God. In the knowlede of God in Christ is revealed too the mystery of our createdness, and the centring of our being and action in eschatological existence. Here, our central identity is not located in &#8216;our&#8217; vocation, production, social alliances (as absolute magnitudes), etc, but in God&#8217;s good ordering of the world and our place in it as receiving our true selves in  God&#8217;s self-giving (which includes these things but not as absolutes determining our existence). Secondly, it is the freedom that we don&#8217;t have to be perfectionists.  To quote Lash &#8216;The story of this learning process (on learning to be a creature) is the history of Jewish and Christian doctrines of God&#8230;there is a sense in which each generation, and indeed each individual, has to take the time to learn this for themselves; has to grow, or fail to grow, into something of what it means to be, in every fibre of one&#8217;s being, absolutely dependent on the mystery that we call God&#8217; {Lash, Theology for Pilgrims, pp. 25}. </p>
<p>Lash&#8217;s  last point I think great for your theme here. That the temptation of thinking &#8216;we&#8217; are central is fundamentally the idolatrous thinking that we are not creatures but &#8216;God&#8217;&#8230; the central significant for determing our selves and our relations. And the spiritual consequence of this has been the &#8216;hells&#8217; of life. However, the liberation that comes from attuning afresh to God&#8217;s self-manifestation in Christ is not simply the re-placement of ourselves as the central object of our concern, devotion and self-interpretation, but its the very ground that gives us the right kind of reading of our lives and significance in our place in the ordering of the world. We do our best work and love when we&#8217;re not fixated on ourselves.</p>
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